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Anderson Cooper 360

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John Paul 12, Jim Bittermann 6, Rome 6, John Allen 6, Us 5, Ben 4, Nasal 4, New Nectresse 4, Mourning 3, Peter 3, Ben Wedeman 3, Benedict 3, Jim 3, United States 2, Europe 2, U.s. 2, John Paul Ii 2, Pope John Paul 2, Unchartered 1, Angel 1,
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  CNN    Anderson Cooper 360    News/Business.  (2013)  (CC)  

    February 27, 2013
    1:00 - 1:59am PST  

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that's all for us tonight.
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. you're looking live at pictures of saint peter's square in vatican city. and in just moments, pope benedict will be arriving one last time as 1.2 million catholics around the world prepare to say farewell to their holy father. good morning and welcome to a special edition of "early start". i'm christian amanpour live from rome on. and we also want to welcome our global viewers on cnn international. this is the final day of the pope's public audiences. pope benedict is about to make his last one right here in the square before stepping down. it is a historic day. becoming the first pope in six centuries to abdicate and he leaves behind a church with many opportunities behind and many
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challenges, as well. and we'll talk all about that later on on in a moment, take a look at saint peter's square, more than 50,000 people we're told are expected to witness the pope's final general audience. the anticipation has been building. here is the schedule for this morning and for the the next couple of days. at 4:30 a.m., that is eastern time, that's 10:30 a.m. here in rome, the pope arrives in his popemobile. it's an unusual way for him to conduct his wednesday audience, but because this is the final time, he's going to spend about 15 minutes we think driving around the square waving to the crowd before he starts talking and starts making prayers and having his final audience as i said. at 5:00 he'll meet with special groups of pilgrims and at 10 past 5 on::005:00, he's schedul
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deliver his final teaching and greeting. and perhaps a final departing messa message. we'll wait to see if he uses any of these occasions to speak publicly to send a special farewell message. he is as i say going to be here. and we'll be staying with the program. i've got my guests and my cnn colleagues here. john allen, who has been with us, a long time cnn contributor, and himself jim bittermann, long time cnn correspondent, has covered many papal elections and transitions. and in the field, we have ben we'der man and becky anderson who will tell us what's going on much closer on to the basilica. john, this is an extraordinary moment. it is truly unprecedented. we can go bhak to pope gregory, but even longer than that, seven centuries ago when a pope
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stepped down voluntarily. put fuss the picture of how much of a chunk this is. >> well, when you cover an institution that has more than 2,000 years of history like the catholic church, you don't get a chance to use the phrase unchartered waters very often. but that truly is where we are. the only real precedent for this is 1294. and shortly after he resigned, he was in prison and died. so this is a completely new situation in which we'll have a retired pope living briefly at the pope summer residence, will eventually relocate into a monastery. and it will be very interesting to see how it plays out. >> again we keep using this unchartered because there has not been in 600 years a living pope and a living pope emeritus. we know that he'll be called
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pope emeritus, still called his holiness. what kind of influence do you think pope benedict 1'6" will have on the conclave and the way the papacy proceeds in the future? >> well, first of all, the most important way the pope has to put his imprint on the election of his successor is by naming the cardinals who will vote. 67 of the 115 cardinals have been named by benedict xvi and any other influence pales in comparison to that. benedict has said he'll be hidden from the world. and so in that sense, he's not going to have any direct fingerprint on the future of the church, but in-evidently there will be people measuring what the new pope does by what the old pope might have done. >> and you mentioned the 67 cardinals he has elevated throughout his eight years on the throne.
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we know that there are so many different facts if you like, different views, different followings of the catholic church depending on where you look. in the the united states, afternoon more progressive wing that would like to see more modernism that correspondents to the challenges of today. we know that in africa and asia, it's growing much faster than anywhere else and by and large much more traditional, more conservative. what do you think the fact that these 67 cardinals who will be voting have been in place by benedict xvi, what do you think that will mean for the direction of the church? inevitably somebody who is in the form, the shape of benedict's traditions? >> the other point to make is the cardinals who weren't appointed by benedict were appointed by john paul 2 rrp. so i think they're all of like mind.
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tt sense papal elections are unlike the iowa caucuses where you have debate. that won't happen. it's more about style and tone than they are about substance. so i don't think you'll get a new pope who will repeal church teaching on abortion or gay marriage. but you could get a pope who uses the post modern world a little more and put a more positive face to the message. >> i want to go to ben we'der man. are the crowds saying anything now? >> people are very much waiting to see and to hear from pope benedict. now, the the italian authorities said they were expecting up to 200,000 people to come today and we know that even in some italian schools, the children have been told if they're an september today, they will not be penalized.
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in order to accommodate the large crowd that's expected, he's doing it outside. people from all over the world here. we're joined actually by one guest, kevin, from washington, d.c., who is visiting rome. your thoughts on this historic day, the next to the last day of pope benedict in office. >> what a for fa nominal week to be here in rome. being a catholic myself, i was so fortunate to be in the area and be able to make it out here today. you know you're watching history. >> and are you going to be here throughout the day? >> i'll be here much of the day. whenever i've had the chance, i've been out here trying to get inside and see the goings on. i'll be here as long as i can todaynd then probably the next few days, also.
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>> what are your thoughts about his time as pope? >> i think he's known as a great theologian. he's always being compared to john paul, but i'm not so sure you should compare. everybody has their own style of doing things. so i think he's done a great job for his style. >> and as a roman catholic, what do you think his legacy will be? >> as a teacher, as a teacher of rome catholicism. >> thank you very much. so we're going to be speaking to lots of people here in st. peter's square today. certainly a lot of appreciation for the reign of pope benedict. >> ben, thanks. we'll keep checking in with you. and in about 20 minutes, the pope will turn up in his popemobile and make the tour around saint peter's square,
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it's not his normal procedure during a wednesday general audience, but because this is his second to last day on the throne of st. peter, he wants to greet as many people as possible. and now coming up after a break, black smoke, white smoke, picking the next pope. we'll look at the sacred duty of choosing the next leader of more than a billion roman catholics worldwide. [ nyquil bottle ] you know i relieve coughs, sneezing, fevers... [ tylenol bottle ] me too! and nasal co [ tissue box ] he said nasal congestion. yeah...i heard him. [ female announcer ] tylenol® cold multi-symptom nighttime relieves nasal congestion. nyquil® cold and flu doesn't.
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welcome back. pope benedict xvi will arrive in about 20 minutes or so and you're looking at a live picture of vatican city. you can see the crowds gathering. and you can see the police presence, the risers, the platforms for dozens and dozens of press from around the world who are coming to record this as
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we've said many times unprecedented, unchartered event in the roman catholic church. at least for the last six centuries or so. what we do know is that the pope will be coming as i said and he'll be in his popemobile very famous and familiar sight to all of those who follow the roman catholic church and the comings and goings of the pontiff certainly since pope john paul ii. it's not usual. he doesn't usually hold his weekly audiences like that, but this is the day before he resigns and, therefore, a little extra is going into this general audience. i'm here now with my colleagues at 4:45 a.m., that would be 10:45 a.m. here the pope starts to read and there will be other biblical readings. he will also have his greeting. and we'll wait to see whether in fact he puts a special farewell message into what is often planned readings for these particular days.
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we're still in lent. and as i'm here with john allen and jim bittermann, this is a special time not just because of the resignation of this pope, the first time in more than 600 years since 1450, but it is lent, that carries a whole different sort of significance of sacrifice and preparation for the catholic church's most significant holiday. >> that's right. lent is a period of penance and spiritual preparation for holy week. and ultimately his triumphant rising from the grave on easter sunday. and actually one of the pope's closest friends, is in the papers this morning saying benedict chose to resign specifically at the beginning of lent because he wanted that spirit of penance and preparation to be part of the psychology as the cardinals begin picking the next pope.
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>> we'll talk about penance and preparation in a moment. i want to go to jim bittermann. with a little bit of the style over the substance, 1.2 billion catholics are very keen to know even the smallest details about the papacy, about the person of the pope. and particularly about the person of the retiring pope. right down to his clothes. i'm just going to play a little bit of what was said yesterday at the vatican about what he'll be called after he steps down, what he'll be wearing in fact. >> he will wear a simple white cassack. very important point are the shoes. they will no longer be the red
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shoes that you've seen him wear, but he's chosen to keep brown shoes given to him on his recent trip to mexico. >> these are the details that people are really interested in, particularly those red shoes. and you can't see the picture right now, but i am in papal yellow around my neck. jim, you have covered many, many papal comings and goings. gives us your sense about what it is about this person that fascinates so many people. >> it's the office more than anything else, more than the personality. when you have a leader of 1.2 billion people that in fact represents an institution that has been around for 2,000 years, it's pretty amazing. and you have to look to that for some guidance as to what the future might be for instance. but just to pick up on what you were talking about earlier about
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tradition, for a pope who is very traditional, for a church that emphasizes tradition, this is the most up traditional period you can imagine. they are making it up as they go along. the shoes, all the rest of that sort of thing, two weeks ago when this was first nnounced, the press peppered the spokesman with all these questions and it's taken two weeks to come up with the answers because they are 00 mamaking it up as they g along. >> and it wasn't until yesterday that we knew how they would be referred to. >> when the conclave would be, how are they going to do that. first we heard that we would follow the constitution of the church which provided for 15 day waiting period after the seat was left vacant. now we're hearing the cardinals will vote. how are they going to it take that vote about when the conclave is going to start?
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it's a real never never land we're into here. the normal working motto of the vatican is talk to me on wednesday and i'll get back to you in 300 years. two weeks is fairly remarkable actually. >> let's talk about what you just said, jim, this whole period, however long it's going to be. the empty seat. what about when the cardinals will meet. you have the entire roster, whether voting age or not, and then you have the voting age who have to get together. give us a sense of that time table. >> the dean of the college of cardinals is going to formally notify the cardinals of the world that the throne of peter is vacant. in a way it's stilly because they're already all in town to
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say good-bye, but protocol must be observed. and then we presume on monday cardinals will hold a general congregation and the first order of business in that meeting will be to pick a date for the conclave because benedict 1" has given them the authority to set aside that 15 day waiting period and move things up if they so choose. many cardinals believe that since we don't need nine days of mourning, we don't need a funeral mass and since they're already all here, they would be of a mind that it's a good idea to bring the curtain up on this show. >> we can hear the music has started, being broadcast on the great big loud speakers behind me. and we'll be watching and waiting for the pope to arrive here shortly and tomorrow of course we'll be with you, as well, because that is the day that he actually leaves the vatican, goes to what is in fact the summer residence of the pope. that is around 5:00 p.m. local
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here. and then at 8:00 p.m. rome time, this papacy will end formally and the time to select the next pope will start as we've just been talking about john allen.
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you're looking live at st. peter's square. in a few moments phone benedict 16th is scheduled to speak here one last time before becoming the first roman catholic pope in six centuries to step down. joined again by john allen and jim bittermann and ben wedeman is in saint peters and we'll be checking in with him, as well. we've been talking about some of the colors, some of the unchartered waters. penance and possibility. john, there is obviously these scandals that have dogged the roman catholic church, particularly the priest abuse scandal against young boys that exploded in the united states since 2002 and here in europe since 2010. how is the church going to deal with this in a final way if you
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like moving forward? is it possible? >> i think there would be a great consensus that in many ways benedict 16th has moved the church forward from where it was when he took over from john paul ii. first pope to meet with victims, first pope to apologize for the crisis in his own name, the first pope in some ways to embrace zero tolerance as the official line of the church. but i also think there is a consensus there is a great deal of unfinished business and at the top of the way, figuring out a way to enforce the accountability. >> some of them are coming here particularly cardinal mahoney of los angeles and many americans had not wanted him to come here and many victims of the sexual abuse scandals have come here to petition for some change. tell me your snap frontrunners for the next pope. who do you think will be the
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next pope? >> well, there is an old saying in rome that he who goes in to the conclave as pope comes out as a cardinal. so this is a hazardous business. if you can did a poll average of vatican watchers, the names you would hear the most would be a car natural from milan, from canadian and probably just one notch down would be sandri, a good candidate to be from the developing world.
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back here it in roam just by st. peter's square, there you can see the basilica. tens of thousands of faithful roman catholics packing the square to say farewell to pope benedict 1xvi. this is his final appearance in public. we'll be conducting what's known as a general audience, usually in the winter he does that inside st. peter's square. but because it is his last time, he'll be doing it outside, he'll be doing it from within the popemobile where he'll come shortly. it's 10:30 a.m. here and we were told this is when the popemobile will be making its appearance with pope benedict xvi final time around the square.
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now, we do know that he will also be taking part in not just greetings and prayers, but also will be making certain messages. i'm joined by john allen and jim bittermann. i can hear loud cheers, so perhaps any minute now the popemobile will come into view. what do you think we'll hear from him today? >> he has a farewell in two acts. tomorrow is his private farewell to cardinals and the people who work with him in the vatican. today, however, is his farewell to the whold worlded. so i expect he'll use the opportunity to reflect on not
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only his understanding and what it means to be pope, but also what shaped the decision, what was behind it and what his hopes for the world would be and of course his hoping for the church that he obviously loves dearly. >> catholics all over the world want to see which direction their faith is going, what direction the church will take in the future and what kind of penance will be done to really atone for not just sins, but some of the crimes that have been committed certainly by pedophile priests in europe and the yupd and perhaps elsewhere. >> we were all here eight years ago goen when phone benedict was elected and before that condu conducting vigil as pope john paul ii lay dying. there is a huge difference, isn't there, pope john paul ii
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lived out his final years in pain, in infirmity, and yet remained caharismatic and a dee draw to roman catholics right until his last breath. even though pope benedict is a scholar, an entake elect all, many who know him call him warm, give me a sense of the difference in character in public persona between those two popes. >> in a sound bite, if john paul had not been pope, he would have been a movie star. benedict would have been a university professor. benedict was the intellectual architect of john paul's papacy for 20 years. so in terms of substance, broad vision for the church, the two were clearly this lock step. but in terms of personality, john paul had a raw sort of freak of nature charisma that took the world by storm. benedict has always been a bit more of an acquired taste. widely admired for the keenness of his intellect. and when i've covered his
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foreign trips, what's interesting is that he often plays best as a cultural critic. a man who engaged in broad trajectories. doesn't generate the same kind of wild enthusiasm at the grass roots, of course, as john paul. >> certainly i can tell that from some of the visits i've done. the real enthusiasm for john paul, a first time pope had con cost to communist cuba and he was incredibly received. i polled pope benedict last year cuba and you could see that he was also very warmly received, but didn't generate the kind of adulation, if you like, the kind of mass cult following that his predecessor between. and from what i understand, it was that trip that which finally convinced him that he was as he said not strong enough mentally
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physically to go on and lead this massive institution. >> one of the things remarkable the other day during the papal mass on ash wednesday, one of the things that happened was the secretary of state rose up and gave a very sort of gushing speech about his reign and how wonderful it was and all the rest. benedict xvi's response was thank you and let's get back to prayer. pope john paul ii would have taken that, taken the applause, gone with it for a few minutes, maybe said a few words, but in fact it was an entirely different reaction. >> john paul also credited with facing down com uhe nation in his own country and tearing done the iron curtain across the soviet union and eastern europe. we're going now to ben wedeman who is in that crowd.
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any sighting yet of the popemobile? >> not yet. we understand he should be coming out any minute now. what we've been listening to is basically various languages. i heard arabic, somebody greeting the international crowd. in fact we're joined by somebody from ireland. you were coming here on an ordinary vacation. >> we were coming for a break for a few days and this just happened as we were leaving. so today where he thought we'd make our way here and experience the history. >> and what was yours reaction when on the 11th of february you heard he was resigning out of
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the blue? >> i think like a lot of people there was surprise. the first time in several hundred years that the pope has decided to make room for somebody else. wondering what was going on really. but i suppose at his age it's a great decision. the first time in a long time he has decided to make way for shall be younger. so maybe he's setting the example for one of the other older leaders around the world of thinking time for a change. i don't know. but certainly it's a great step for him and we all wish him luck. >> thank you very much. so lots of people from all over and as i said, we are waiting for the pope to emerge for this his penultimate day as pope. >> ben, thank you very much. and as we're watching, we can see these incredible live pictures. you've got rows and rows waiting
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for pope benedict to arrive. you see the overhead shot of seating and standing room. we saw the bishops there, the papal colors of the yellow and white balloons. we've seen newspapers. and we'll be coming back after a break as we a wait pope benedict xvi to take his tour around saint peter's square.
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welcome back to our live coverage of the pope's final appearance. there you see the pope has come
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into st. peter's square. a little later than expected, but nonetheless there he is in that famous popemobile. you can see that he's surrounded by people walking around his vehicle and obviously cameras right there to record every last step, every last wheel as you tours around the square to say farewell. this is his general wednesday audience. slightly different because it is his final one. he would usually hold these weekly audiences inside st. peter's about a lbasilica, but taking the lap around the square being greeted by all the pilgrims that have come here. the vatican has handed out at least 50,000 tickets. obviously the inside of st. peter's square can hold many, many more, standing and seated. we've seen pictures of the cardinals waiting at least 55 of them already by our country down
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there. we've seen the bishops, we've seen nuns and we've seen all these pilgrims. we've heard from them as to why they're here because they want to take part in this historic day to share in this historic moment. because let's not forget that even though pep benedict xvi has only been on the throne for eight years, that is not a huge long time compared to john paul ii rb who was there from 1978 to 2005 and who lived his final years in infirmity and some say agony in a public way. pope benedict 16 xvi said he wad somebody stronger to guide the church throughout the future.
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you see him approaching those phenomenal columns, the arms of the vatican spread out almost embracing sait. peter's square. today after this general audience, after the speeches, after the prayers, after the greeting of certain select pilgrims, he will then return to the vatican and get ready we understand he's already been packing up over these last couple of days because at 5:00 p.m. rome time, that's 11:00 a.m. eastern time, the pope will leave by helicopter from the vatican to the summer papal residence. he'll spend several months there while they're getting his permanent residence ready here again in vatican, it will be a converted con vent and he will be staying there throughout the rest of his life. joined again by john allen, our senior vatican correspondent
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contributor and also jim bittermann. just about where he's going to live and how long he's going to be in castel gandolfo, that is also certainly to take into account the logistics of moving a pope to a pope emeritus, but is there also a feeling that perhaps the pope does not want to be seen to be right over the shoulder of his successor and particularly in this period while they're choosing him? >> oh, sure. they're continuing the renovations on the former monastery. and by the way, when an italian contractor tells you it will take two months, i would double that at least. so we'll see when he actually moves back into the vatican. but the other plig sub text is there's a real concern that benedict not be seen as in some way of trying to shape or influence the process of picking his successor.
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>> jim, we were here in 2005. this is so different in so many ways. usually there is a death that we report, there is a funeral. give us a little bit of your experiences in the past. >> with the other ones, there is a period of mourning. pilgrims come to rome. there is a very solemn atmosphere. it gets them in a mood and spirit for electing a new pope. here you have a pope stepping down. and by the way, they're calling this an abdication. and since it is a monarchy, probably the right word to use. in any case, because benedict xvi is leaving so precipitously, there hasn't been the period of preparation for people to start thinking of a new pope.
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and on the other hand, maybe because of the publicity around it tcardinals are thinking of i. so completely different. nowhere near as solemn. certainly a lot of tears said when he leave, but not necessarily as solemn as when you have a papal death. >> talking of tears shed and waving going on, let go to ben wedeman down there in the square for reaction to now the pope being there amongst the faithful. ben. >> we didn't hear large applause or clapping, but i think people very much appreciative of the fact that this is the last opportunity to see him as pope benedict making the tour of st. peter's square. now, we are joined by somebody also from germany, angel, you live in italy. this is a german pope.
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how do you feel about the fact that he's stepping down, he's resigning? >> i'm very sad. i also wrote him a letter trying to encourage him to remain. because i love him so much and because he did great things. i prirktappreciated the pope ve much. he stepped into the foot steps pope john paul ii and of our lord. >> what do you think his greatest achievement was? >> personally two things i really appreciated very much is the introduction of the latin mass which is such a strong experience. it's a very profound experience especially for the young people. and the second thing is that he fostered perpetual adoration in every city or in every diocese.
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but basically everywhere. and that can come only from the heart that prays. because eucharistic adoration is so powerful. it's the key to change the world from the inside. >> all right. thank you very much. like pope benedict from germany. so we're expecting more -- i can't tell if the pope is still out in the popemobile, but nobody is leaving. everybody is looking at those big screens over st. peter's square. >> well, ben, i have an advantage, i can see the bird's eye view of st. peter's square. so he most definitely is still there. the popemobile still continues to do the tour and indeed we've seen people lifting children, lifting babies up for the pope to kiss. we'll be right back. up next, more from the crowd and as you said they are part of something historic.
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and let's not forget that pope benedi benedict, a german, pope john paul from poland, the first nonitalian popes in about 500 years.
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welcome back to our special coverage of the pope's second as to last day. he's in his popemobile touring the st. peter's square. and he's saying farewell to the faithful who have come to see his last general audience. shortly he'll begin speaking and we'll bring you his address. first, though, we're going to new york for some of the latest headlines. >> thank you, we appreciate it. and right now, the deadly winter storm that dumped record snow, canceled flights and caused
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power outages throughout the plain states and texas panhandle is headed for the northeast. heavy snow and ice collapsed roofs, trees and power lines with them, cutting power to thousands in the plains. snow is expected in michigan and western new york state and that storm does not appear to be weakening. santa cruz, california, the police department is mourning two officers killed in the line of duty. the officers were gunned down yesterday while responding to a report of possible can domestic violence. the gunman was killed a short time later in a shoot-out with police. and the u.s. is moving toward getting syrian rebels direct aid including sending nonlethal military equipment and possibly providing strategic military training. the u.s. is not considering providing weapons to the rebels. john kerry is discussing the changes with european allies on on his first overseas trip since
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taking the job. just two days until the forced spending cut kick in and there are no meetings scheduled between the white house and congressional leaders. president obama visited a ship yard yesterday in virginia to highlight the negative impact of the impending cuts. congressional republicans dismissed the visit as a prop to support p president's tax hike. >> that's a quick look at your local headlines. let's send it back to the vatican. >> thank you. and yes indeed we're here, it is all about white and yellow right now, the papal color, and the pope is about to start speaking to address the faithful for the final time as holy father. and our special coverage continues at the top of the hour. of course we'll be here when he actually leaves the vatican which is at about 11:00 a.m. eastern time and also when finally his papacy ends, that
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will be 8:00 p.m. rome i'm today. [ female announcer ] born from the sweet monk fruit, something this delicious could only come from nature. new nectresse. the 100% natural no-calorie sweetener made from the goodness of fruit. new nectresse. sweetness naturally.
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[ nyquil bottle ] just reading your label. wait...you relieve nasal congestion? sure don't you?
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[ nyquil bottle ] dude! [ female announcer ] tylenol® cold multi-symptom nighttime relieves nasal congestion. nyquil® cold and flu doesn't. you're taking a look at live pictures from st. peter's square where tens of thousands of pilgrims have gathered to say tear well to pope benedict xvi who will be speaking as holy father for the last time. we're expecting that to happen just minutes from now. meanwhile heavy snow closing highways and crushing homes. a deadly winter storm on the move right now and the